Sean Maloughney: Was Ken Holland Good... Or Lucky?

All in all Holland did a pretty good job,especially with the little cap room he had to work with..
His best work was ditching Lucic , and made it even better by sticking it to the flamers..

Lucky!

No one saw Draisaitl playing the way he has this season. He instantly made Hopkins and Yamamoto into offensive threats. Is he doesn’t win the Hart it will only further prove the voting is a farce.

Judgement on the td deals should be reserved til we see them in the playoffs.

I for one didn’t think the Oil would be relevant for this long. Congrats! Too bad it may just be an* in the history books.

All in all Holland did a pretty good job,especially with the little cap room he had to work with..
His best work was ditching Lucic , and made it even better by sticking it to the flamers..


- oilpatch

Wow! That’s what you base success on? Lucic has done more for the Flames this year than Neal ever did. Maybe Peters mismanaged him last year or maybe Neal woke the fuk up and realized he might have to put some work in.
Regardless most fans from both teams are happy with the trade. We can call it a win win for both!

Why would you be patting yourself on the back for the canucks having a good year?

They are technically out of the playoffs.

I guess the last horrible dozen years or so of watching super horrible hockey in edmonton have really reduced your standards.

I think the more interesting post you should put up is where will connor mcdavid play in the 2021-22 season?

Cause it won’t be in edmonton...he will have had enough playing for that mickey mouse organization.

Hiring Dave Tippett was Holland's best move.

Hiring Dave Tippett was Holland's best move.
- gergeswillems

And Neal has done more this season than Lucic had done the year before.....I don't see your point. Fact is, he is easier to move or buyout. Not saying Calgary didn't get anything of value, but Holland did well moving away from the contract.

the one area that he "failed" IMO is not trading Pullijarvi.

the longer he's away from the NHL, the less he's worth.....regardless of how he plays in Finland. he should have just moved him last off-season and be done with it.

the one area that he "failed" IMO is not trading Pullijarvi.

the longer he's away from the NHL, the less he's worth.....regardless of how he plays in Finland. he should have just moved him last off-season and be done with it.
- sensarmy_11

Puljarvi was worth nothing last offseason. There was very little offered for him up until december , so why move him just for the sake of it ? He can be packaged in another trade for a better return at this years draft..
For example: Kris Russell and Pulljarvi for ?

Wow! That’s what you base success on? Lucic has done more for the Flames this year than Neal ever did. Maybe Peters mismanaged him last year or maybe Neal woke the fuk up and realized he might have to put some work in.
Regardless most fans from both teams are happy with the trade. We can call it a win win for both!
- K-man25

You can call it all you want

I was skeptical about what Holland could do his first year but he’s proven to be more effective than I thought he ever could be in a small amount of time.

It’s a little bit of luck in that I think last year’s team was pretty unlucky in terms of wins so they were due to bounce back, but that’s just a small part of their success. Holland made some really solid depth signings and bringing in Smith seems to have solidified that position. To me, those were two areas that killed them last year and he managed to address them quickly and efficiently. The Neal/Lucic deal was decent, but I honestly think it didn’t make much of a difference in terms of their overall success. He scored some goals but I think the Oilers would be in the same spot with or without him, just personal opinion.

Holland is proving the doubters wrong so far, excited to see what they do over the next few years.

Try and spin it however you want, but Holland got hosed on the Lucic deal. Lucic is a decent bottom six guy making way too much money. Neal is a guy who shouldn't be in the league getting paid 5.75 million.

Fun fact, Neal had a great October, since then, Lucic and Neal have scored the same number of goals and Neal has one more point. Neal also steals way more ice time from more deserving players than Lucic does. Neal has done nothing since October to earn a spot in the lineup and has not made the Oilers PP better.

Bring up the fact that Neal can be paid to go away if you want, but that scenario doesn't favour the Oilers nearly as much as you're trying to say it does. The Oilers would have Neal on the cap for 2 million for six years. That sucks. They're also still paying Lucic 750k a year. Buying out Lucic sucks for three years, but then he's basically off the cap.

Try and spin it however you want, but Holland got hosed on the Lucic deal. Lucic is a decent bottom six guy making way too much money. Neal is a guy who shouldn't be in the league getting paid 5.75 million.

Fun fact, Neal had a great October, since then, Lucic and Neal have scored the same number of goals and Neal has one more point. Neal also steals way more ice time from more deserving players than Lucic does. Neal has done nothing since October to earn a spot in the lineup and has not made the Oilers PP better.

Bring up the fact that Neal can be paid to go away if you want, but that scenario doesn't favour the Oilers nearly as much as you're trying to say it does. The Oilers would have Neal on the cap for 2 million for six years. That sucks. They're also still paying Lucic 750k a year. Buying out Lucic sucks for three years, but then he's basically off the cap.
- Hunkulese

The cope is real with this one

The cope is real with this one
- MaximumBone

Seriously. Same points since November 1st with 16ish less games played. But its an even trade. Flames management and fans rushed to judgement on a guy over played for the prior 2 seasons and it affected his game play and didn't want to give him an opportunity because he didn't seize it the first time.

Put back into his right role as a complimentary player with PP specialty time and meh to a touch of top 6 time and he has succeeded. But he is worth less than a guy averaging about .2ppg less, brought in to add some muscle and enforce for the little skilled guys, with 4 fights, 1 of which was a jumping, 1 of which was a toss up according to hockeyfights voters, 1 a clear win, and 1 vs a non-fighters.

Then take into account their buyouts if teams chose to go that way...
Lucy avg's 6M per for 3 more years.
Neal avg's 1.9 per for 6 more.

What is more easily swallowed?

But hey, a 5.5 hit for 3 years for a 4th liner who doesn't fight anymore and rarely chips in is worth the 1.9 buyout if thats what they choose.

No picks.

Wow, thought there'd be more chatter here about Marino, and how the Pens got him for basically nothing. Idk, maybe Edmonton is so far away from civilization that y'all haven't heard how well Marino has been playing for Pittsburgh... or maybe just flat out ignoring it all is the best medicine... but I think Holland may have made a mistake here. Glad he did.
But hey, if you guys are getting great results from the likes of Archibald and Sheahan (both ex-Pens) then maybe everything works out in the end, eh?

But make no mistake, Marino IS a stud... stepped in and looks like he's been a regular top-4 NHL Dman for 5 or 6 years. For this, we thank ya!

Wow, thought there'd be more chatter here about Marino, and how the Pens got him for basically nothing. Idk, maybe Edmonton is so far away from civilization that y'all haven't heard how well Marino has been playing for Pittsburgh... or maybe just flat out ignoring it all is the best medicine... but I think Holland may have made a mistake here. Glad he did.
But hey, if you guys are getting great results from the likes of Archibald and Sheahan (both ex-Pens) then maybe everything works out in the end, eh?

But make no mistake, Marino IS a stud... stepped in and looks like he's been a regular top-4 NHL Dman for 5 or 6 years. For this, we thank ya!
- Cousinskrid

Perhaps you missed the fact that he was a College player and told the Oilers he would not be signing with them upon the completion of his season. So they got what they could for him. Wasn't that they didn't want him, he didn't want them.

Wow! That’s what you base success on? Lucic has done more for the Flames this year than Neal ever did. Maybe Peters mismanaged him last year or maybe Neal woke the fuk up and realized he might have to put some work in.
Regardless most fans from both teams are happy with the trade. We can call it a win win for both!
- K-man25

Lucic had 6/14=20 Pts in 79 games. This year 8 goals and 20 points in 68 games. That's not exactly an improvement to jump for joy over.

Last year Neal had 7/12=19P in 63 GP. Flames are NOT getting any spike in production based on that trade...

Perhaps you missed the fact that he was a College player and told the Oilers he would not be signing with them upon the completion of his season. So they got what they could for him. Wasn't that they didn't want him, he didn't want them.
- wreckage

I was aware... it's not so much about that, but the fact that he appears to be so darn solid and seems so comfortable on the ice... that ANYONE could land him for such a lowly pick. Almost as if none of the pro scouts had no idea who he was... or Holland could've maybe held onto him for a higher ransom.

Regardless of whether Neal or Lucic get bought out or not, is that Calgary is forced into a tough situation. They have to either buy Lucic out with no cap savings or protect him in the upcoming Seattle expansion draft. I wonder if Calgary would rather be tight to the cap or risk losing a more talented player? Edmonton getting out of that scenario is why I think they won the trade.

I was aware... it's not so much about that, but the fact that he appears to be so darn solid and seems so comfortable on the ice... that ANYONE could land him for such a lowly pick. Almost as if none of the pro scouts had no idea who he was... or Holland could've maybe held onto him for a higher ransom.
- Cousinskrid

The facts we have are 1.) he didn't want to sign with Edmonton, 2.) he was fresh off a 3rd season in college where he produced 11 points in 33 games and 3.) his draft pedigree and scouting reports didn't really have him as some elite defensive stud to make up for the lack of offense. Now, you're more than free to believe there was a market beyond the 6th Holland got, but I'm VERY doubtful of any such claim.

Sometimes players make fundamental changes over an offseason that lead to magnificent, unforeseeable results (look at Ethan Bear as an example) and sometimes a player's game just translates perfectly to a higher league. Both seem to have been the case for Marino this year and that's great for him and you guys!

Trying to make this as some failure on Holland's part isn't a good look for you.

Great blog.

Going with lucky. I think relying on an ancient Smith coming off a very poor season sums up most his moves. Significantly more lucky than good.

However I have a heaping of crow to eat if the season/playoffs happen and the Oilers make it.

I, and the vast majority of pundits, had the 2016-2017 Oilers being a powerhouse moving forward. But little did we all know the wheels would come off and the team would collapse epically for 2 more years before having a solid season this year to date.

I like the 2017-2018 Oilers team that started that year equal to or more than the 2020-2021 team is currently shaping up to be.

Can we really expect Draisaitl and McDavid to post > 1.5 ppg paces. A starting tandem of old Smith and inconsistent Koskinen. Getting historical PP stats. Amazing PK stats. No softmore slumps from Yamamoto, Bear, and Jones. 19 hials from Neal. Archibald to score at a career best... etc...

This team on paper to my eye is far less sustainable compared to the 2017-2018 team that fell apart.

With everything that has gone right with the Oilers they are on pace for an average season...playoff bar is just low in the West this year

low 90s points is a failure most seasons

I mean they have been getting out shot 2:1 or worse often and finding a way

People hear they are fighting for the division and think they have had some awesome year...the team just above them and just below them in the standings have had terrible seasons based on expectations and fired their coaches

Going with luck on this one

Regardless of whether Neal or Lucic get bought out or not, is that Calgary is forced into a tough situation. They have to either buy Lucic out with no cap savings or protect him in the upcoming Seattle expansion draft. I wonder if Calgary would rather be tight to the cap or risk losing a more talented player? Edmonton getting out of that scenario is why I think they won the trade.
- JayArr

The Lucic protection stuff is so overblown

First...what 7 forwards are the Oilers protecting without Lucic?

Why wouldn't Lucic waive for the expansion draft?

Look at the Flames roster....almost certain they are losing a dman no matter if Lucic is protected or not doesn't change that

99.9% chance Lucic in the expansion draft means zero

Lucic had 6/14=20 Pts in 79 games. This year 8 goals and 20 points in 68 games. That's not exactly an improvement to jump for joy over.

Last year Neal had 7/12=19P in 63 GP. Flames are NOT getting any spike in production based on that trade...
- Nasty_Duck

I know basic math can be tough, but 8 goals and 20 points is more than 7 goals and 19 points. Lucic is also in the lineup for everything else he brings besides scoring. Neal is only in the lineup for scoring, which he did for 2 weeks to start the year. But I guess to be fair to Neal, the fact that he can't stay healthy does benefit the team stuck with him.

Calgary has no reason to buy out Lucic, but if they were both bought out, Lucic probably gets another deal. No one is even calling Neal.

Just curious, have any of the Oilers fans actually watched the team play in the past five months?